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COOP News (ehemals: Wamu /WMIH)

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COOP News (ehemals: Wamu /WMIH) charly503
charly503:

lecker wieder

9
12.07.13 12:14
Einige Leute, besonders Warren Buffett, glauben, dass die Gesellschaft besser dran sei, wenn jede Generation ihr Geld selber verdienen müsse. Buffett glaubt, dass die Leute, welche ein Vermögen verdient haben, auch diejenigen sein sollten, welches es kontrollieren – und nicht diejenigen, welche es einfach geerbt haben, er nennt das “Mitglied im Club der glücklichen Spermien” zu sein.

Um dieses Ziel zu erreichen, schlägt Buffett vor, dass der Reichtum jeder sterbenden Generation so stark besteuert werden sollte, dass die nächste Generation wieder von vorne beginnen kann/muss.

Der Gute Warren vergisst aber dabei, das auch Schulden geerbt werden können.
Ich weiß von Nationen, welche dieses Erbe aber nicht ausschlagen können!

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COOP News (ehemals: Wamu /WMIH) paketix
paketix:

immer wenn wir 'milliarden' lesen

3
12.07.13 12:43
denken wir instinktiv dass diese in unsere taschen wandern - keine sorge, JPM hat da dieselbe denke ... :)
so looong *klonk* ... gönnt euch ein kühles helles!
/paketix
COOP News (ehemals: Wamu /WMIH) paketix
paketix:

test ... test ... test ...

5
12.07.13 13:40
alle in ferien?
idealer zeitpunkt für eine 'explosion' bei exWAMU/WMIH mmn. :)
ps: das kühle helle nicht vergessen ... flüssigkeit ist wichtig bei der hitze
/paketix
COOP News (ehemals: Wamu /WMIH) The_Hope
The_Hope:

quark :-)

9
12.07.13 14:22
COOP News (ehemals: Wamu /WMIH) Schwarzwälder
Schwarzwäld.:

The_Hope

10
12.07.13 14:42
"Quark :-)"

Beinhaltet einen Tippfehler:  Quak !
Explosch`n jetzt wäre ideal ! Quak ! (Ich habe gesprochen...)
..........................................................

paketix:
"....immer wenn wir 'milliarden' lesen denken wir instinktiv,

                             dass diese in   U N S E R E   taschen wandern..."

- keine sorge, JPM hat da dieselbe denke ... :-)"

Also wir denken, diese Mrd. fließen in unseren Taschen u. J.P.M. denkt DAS SELBE,
ergo, daß die Mrd. in unsere Taschen wandern, dann wäre das doch ganz hervor-
ragend für uns ! ☺☼☻ :-)))

Gruß,
SW.  
COOP News (ehemals: Wamu /WMIH) berlinlebt
berlinlebt:

OT-JP Morgan verdient prächtig

9
12.07.13 17:07

JP Morgan hat die Berichtssaison der US-Banken mit einem soliden Gewinnsprung eröffnet: Der Überschuss legte im zweiten Quartal auf 6,5 Milliarden Dollar zu, im Vergleich zum Vorjahr ist das ein Plus von fast einem Drittel. Das Unternehmen schnitt vor allem im Investmentbanking besser ab als erwartet.

Doch JP Morgan profitierte auch davon, dass etwa im Immobiliengeschäft einen Teil der Risikovorsorge für faule Kredite aufgelöst werden konnte.

http://www.n-tv.de/wirtschaft/...dient-praechtig-article10984071.html

Immer weiter mit der Auflösung der Rückstellungen...

COOP News (ehemals: Wamu /WMIH) The_Hope
The_Hope:

ja, im Schwarzwald :-)

4
12.07.13 17:13
Der richtige Ruhrpott-Frosch macht "quark"

Da weiß man, wo der Frosch die Locken hat

Glückauf und schönes Wochenende  
COOP News (ehemals: Wamu /WMIH) noenough
noenough:

heeeeeeeeeeeeey schnuckiies!

29
12.07.13 18:35
ich bins der wilde aus dem sueden!

hier gibts sogar internet

gruesse euch alle aus Tenerife der Mega Traum...........diese Insel!

schon der Flug war der knaller aber dazu spaeter vielleicht mehr ich bin mir aber nicht ganz sicher ob ich zurueck komm!

hier gibts 150dausend verschiedene schnuckies aller rassen und farben und diese melonen mmh die sind wirklich saftig!

ich wohne zwischen Bananen Baeume sowas habt ihr noch nicht gesehen nur traeumen isch schoener!

wuensche euch allen zucker-schnuckiies mit eueren liebsten eine schoene zeit

alles liebe und gute!

melde mich wieder wenns was neues gibt!


isch doch richtig oder!?

COOP News (ehemals: Wamu /WMIH) faster
faster:

@sommer 3

13
12.07.13 19:24
berlinlebt, gabs da nicht mal ein paar gauner, die hier im forum über die ach so gutherzige jpm und die ach so schlechten wamu kredite geschrieben haben?

wenn man da " ... und der Grund dafür wahrscheinlich geringere Kreditausfallrückstellungen und etwas bessere Kapitalmarkterträge gewesen seien. Diese seien allerdings durch schwächere Nettozinsmargen und Nettozinserträge gemindert worden. ... " liesst, und an die manipulierenden beiträge unserer spezialisten denkt, da ist doch eine klitzekleine diskrepanz zu erkennen, oder?

pfandflasche, was ist los mit den ach so schlechten wamukrediten, die von jpm gestohlen wurden?
"ein silber panda oder ein silber kookaburra kann die welt verbessern, grins" crasht jpm
COOP News (ehemals: Wamu /WMIH) MacBull
MacBull:

Schönen Urlaub für noenough und seinen

6
12.07.13 22:43
Schnuckies ;-)

Hoffentlich können wir uns durch wmi auch bald so einen schönen Urlaub leisten...

Allen ein schönes WE egal ob auf Gran Terassiea, Bad mein Garden oder auf Balkonien!!

MacBull
COOP News (ehemals: Wamu /WMIH) MacBull
MacBull:

Und nur mal so nebenbei:

5
12.07.13 22:47
Wir sind auf Kurs !!
COOP News (ehemals: Wamu /WMIH) charly503
charly503:

etwas für den User The Ghost

5
12.07.13 22:57
COOP News (ehemals: Wamu /WMIH) Schwarzwälder
Schwarzwäld.:

MacBull

8
12.07.13 23:25
"Und nur mal so nebenbei : "Wir sind auf Kurs" !!"

Der Spruch kommt mir irgendwie bekannt vor ...
Ach ja, ich glaub`jetzt hab`ich`s:
Sagte das der Kapitän der Titanic nicht auch ! ... :-)))))

Also Leute Kopf hoch, das schwerste kommt noch ...,
nämlich die Entscheidung, wohin dann mit der Penunze,
damit das Merkel/Schäuble-Geldverbrennungs-Duo uns das dann nicht wieder abnimmt ....
Denn: Kroatien ick hör`dir trapsen ....

Gruß,
SW.  
COOP News (ehemals: Wamu /WMIH) Hotstockrunner
Hotstockrunn.:

die kohle durchzubringen

5
13.07.13 00:27
stellt für mich kein problem dar
guter Whiskey,rassige frauen und schnelle Fahrzeuge
und den erst....würde ich einfach mal verprassen
+
danke koelner und odin für die kurzen aber knackigen einwürfe bei den verzweifelten "was mache ich noch nieder an dem wert und deren Besitzer"Schreiber auf w:0
"Nur weil du paranoid bist, heißt das nicht, dass sie nicht hinter dir her sind."
Terry Pratchett
COOP News (ehemals: Wamu /WMIH) Hotstockrunner
Hotstockrunn.:

es sollte rest und nicht erst heissen

3
13.07.13 00:29
sorry ,
"Nur weil du paranoid bist, heißt das nicht, dass sie nicht hinter dir her sind."
Terry Pratchett
COOP News (ehemals: Wamu /WMIH) chris0155
chris0155:

Frage:

3
13.07.13 11:16
wie verhält es sich eigentlich mit der Besteuerung der Escrows, falls Geld fließt?
Eigentlich sind das ja keine Aktien(-gewinne), sondern "Entschädigungszahlungen", oder?

Keine Ahnung, ob da ein Unterschied besteht.  Ansonsten würde ja genauso wie bei Aktienverkäufen die Kapitalertragssteuer anfallen...

COOP News (ehemals: Wamu /WMIH) Schwarzwälder
Schwarzwäld.:

chris0155 - zur Escrows-Versteuerung

6
13.07.13 14:36
Also ganz grundsätzlich gilt:

Sie haben WaMu (od. WMIH) Aktien gekauft und im Falle Sie diese / oder Teile daraus wieder verkaufen, sind diese grundsätzlich Abgeltungssteuerpflichtig. Dabei spielt die Geschichte des Papiers keinerlei Rolle. Außerdem sind wir, die Papieren erst "danach"
gekauft haben, keine Geschädigten. Wir warten darauf, daß die Übeltäter J.P.M. / G.S. / FDIC Zahlungen leisten müssen die entweder in die Escrows oder in die anderen Papiere fließen. Das ist ein Unterschied ! Die sogen. Escrows (man könnte sie in gewissem  Sinne auch "Genußscheine" (=Recht auf (Rück-)Zahlung) nennen), resultieren aus Ihrem WaMu-Aktienkauf und werden steuerlich ebenso behandelt. Alles woraus künftiges Geld der Escrows oder WMIH resultiert, Assets, Nols, Abschreibungen od. sonst. Geldeingänge zu Gunsten der jetzigen, jeweiligen Papiere, sind somit mit 25 % abgeltungssteuerpflichtig.

Vermindern können Sie diese Steuer entweder mit anderen, im selben Jahr des Verkaufes oder in Vorjahren (wenn dem FA in der St.Erkl. gemeldet), bei Ihnen aus anderen FINANZGESCHÄFTEN angefallenen Verlusten. Dies geschähe durch Aufrechnung !
Andere Möglichkeit: Liegt Ihr EkSt.-Satz niedriger, bekommen Sie auf speziellen Antrag
die %-uale Differenz vom Fa. wieder erstattet. Liegt Ihr EkSt.-Satz jedoch höher,
belassen Sie es bei den von Ihrer Bank bereits sofort nach Gewinnrealisierung ans FA. abgeführten 25 % ! D.h. Sie haben durch die gesetzl. Einführung dieser Regelung
einen geldwerten Vorteil gegenüber der früheren steuerl. Regelung !

Bei sogen. "Entschädigungszahlungen", von welchen es viele verschiedene gibt, kommt es

wiederum drauf an, um welche Art es sich handelt. Übungsleiter z.B. haben einen jährl. Freibetrag von € 2.400,--, der darüber hinaus gehenden Betrag muß versteuert werden.
Bei Entschädigungen für irgend ein Ehrenamt sind das z.B. € 720,-- der übersteigende
Betrag ist ebenso steuerpflichtig. Es kommt eben haupts. darauf an, handelt es sich um Haupttätigkeiten, Nebentätigkeiten, Tätigkeiten bei gemeinnützigen Einrichtungen
u.v.a.m.. Die jew. Freibeträge dann übersteigenden Einnahmen werden vom Fiskus wie Einkünfte gewertet und sind somit voll steuerpflichtig zu Ihrem pers. Steuersatz !
Überschreiten Sie durch diese Einkünfte die Höchstgrenze Ihres bisherigen Steuersatzes und fallen damit der Progression zum Opfer, erhöht sich Ihr %-ualer Steuersatz gemäß
Ihrer dann neuen Steuerklasse. Das bedeutet, Ihre Frage bzgl. Entschädigungszahlungen kann pauschal nicht beantwortet werden !

Stürzt z.B. nach Stilllegung einer Bergbauzeche Ihr Haus ein und das Bergbauunterneh-
men existiert noch (was ja meist nicht mehr der Fall ist) und diese Zeche träfe ein ursächliches Verschulden,  hätten Sie einen "ANSPRUCH" auf eine Entschädigungszahlung im klassischen Sinne. D.h. es fiele in solch` einem Fall natürlich KEINE Steuer an !    
COOP News (ehemals: Wamu /WMIH) Sos137
Sos137:

@Schwarzwälder - zur Escrows-Versteuerung (22267)

4
13.07.13 15:05
Diese Ausführungen gelten natürlich nur für Aktien die ab dem 01.01.2009 gekauft wurden.

Alle "Gewinne" (sei es per WMIH oder per Escrows) von Aktien, die vor diesem Datum gekauft wurden, bleiben steuerfrei !

Sollten wir von der WMIH jemals eine Dividende ausgezahlt bekommen, so ist diese in jedem Fall zu versteuern!
COOP News (ehemals: Wamu /WMIH) ChangNoi
ChangNoi:

Da lohnt es bald

6
13.07.13 15:41
Einen Wohnsitz in Portugal zu haben , da gibt es keine Kapitalertragssteuer auf Aktiengewinne nach 12 Monaten ;)

Google kapitalertragssteuer EU

de.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Abgeltungsteuer
COOP News (ehemals: Wamu /WMIH) Pinot_Grigio
Pinot_Grigio:

Portugal

6
13.07.13 18:40
Und Rentner die jetzt nach Portugal kommen zahlen überhaupt keine Steuern mehr. Diese Regelung gilt allerdings nur für Neuzugänge, diejenigen die schon vor Jahren Ausgewandert sind, zahlen weiterhin ihre Steuern. Aber erheblich weniger als hier. Der Bericht kam neulich im Fernsehen (Auslandsjournal).  
COOP News (ehemals: Wamu /WMIH) faster
faster:

@sommer 4

20
13.07.13 18:55
ein bericht von reuters über einen kandidaten für ein politisches amt in new york:

www.reuters.com/article/2013/07/13/...et-idUSBRE96C06G20130713

und ein paar gedanken dazu (ohne jetzt auf die art, wie die wallstreet einen politiker, dewr ihr nicht passt, abgeschossen hat, näher einzugeheh, grins):

" ... The comptroller also signs off on New York's bonds and oversees the city's five employee pension funds, which have a total value of about $139 billion.

In interviews this week, Spitzer has pointed to the role of pension fund administrator as one he could use to pressure corporations to change their practices. ... "

falls gewählt, würde spitzer etwa 139 mrd dollar von den verschiedenen pensionsrücklagen der stadt new york kontrolieren. und könnte diese jederzeit von einem konto auf einer bank auf ein konto bei einer anderen transferieren, wenn diese andere bank "bessere" bedingungen bietet.

ein schelm, wer dabei an die milliarden denkt, die bei wamu im september 2008 angeblich abgezogen wurden (es waren angeblich etwa 15 mrd). und da stellt sich natürlich die frage, wieviel mrd hat der gauner richard daley (exbürgermeister von chikago und berater von jpm) kontrolliert? es wäre doch zu schön, wenn man wüsste, wer alles beim bank walk auf die wamu beteiligt war.

und " ... Spitzer might be able to use his stature to persuade other states and institutions to join him in shareholder activism, but any change could be only incremental to the ongoing efforts of the New York comptroller's office.

The current comptroller, John Liu, filed 61 shareholder proposals at 58 companies in 2012. Twenty three were adopted or settled. Of 31 proposals that went to a shareholder vote, only eight passed.

One of Liu's highest-profile pushes was to try to split Jamie Dimon's role as chairman and chief executive of JPMorgan Chase & Co into two. About a third of shareholders backed Liu's latest effort, down from 40 percent the year before. ... "

zeigt, dass der bisherige comptroller of new york kein besonderer freund unseres obergauners jamie dimon ist, mal sehen, ob spitzer da noch massiver einsteigt, oder ob er gelernt hat, wen man besser nicht ärgern sollte, breites schräges grins.

tja, im land der unbegrenzten gaunereien gibts auch im sommer immer wieder mal nette kleine entwicklungen.

" ... Liu, for example, criticized the New York Police Department's stop-and-frisk practices and attacked Mayor Michael Bloomberg over city contracts. Liu, who did not comment on Spitzer's ambitions, is now running for mayor. ... "

ein bürgermeister liu und ein comptroller spitzer wäre doch eine neue herausforderung für die gauner von goldman sachs und jpm, und würde die frage aufwerfen, welche hure (oder huren) sie diesmal einsetzen würden, um missliebige politiker loszuwerden, erwartungsvolles grins.
"ein silber panda oder ein silber kookaburra kann die welt verbessern, grins" crasht jpm
Gelöschter Beitrag. Einblenden »
#22273

COOP News (ehemals: Wamu /WMIH) justnormal
justnormal:

etwas OT oder vielleicht auch nicht...

9
13.07.13 20:33
How The Big Players Manipulate The Stock Market?
It is a very good read and worth a cup of coffe on this beautiful Saturday Morning! Enjoy!
See two section I highlighted in Red - Very Important for longs!

 I have always wondered if the big stock traders were able to manipulate  the stock market and how they did it. Now I am confident that I know  the answer to both of these questions, and you will too, after you read  this article, and view the information in the links provided. I describe  and illustrate the process they use to manipulate stocks in easy to  understand terms. First, so you don't think I am totally out of my mind  making these allegations, here is a link for you to view a YouTube video  of CNBC's Jim Cramer titled, "Market Manipulation is a fact" and a link  to Jim Cramer's Wikepedia where you can find the following excerpt-

 "In March 2007, a December 2006 interview from TheStreet.com's "Wall  Street Confidential" webcast stirred controversy after it appeared on  YouTube.com. In the video, Cramer described activities used by hedge  fund managers to manipulate stock prices - some of debatable legality  and others illegal. He described how he could push stocks higher or  lower with as little as $5 million in capital when he was running his  hedge fund. Cramer said, "A lot of times when I was short at my hedge  fund...When I was positioned short-meaning I needed it down-I would  create a level of activity beforehand that could drive the futures." He  also encouraged hedge funds to engage in this type of activity because  it is "a very quick way to make money"."

"Cramer stated that  everything he did was legal, but that illegal activity is common in the  hedge fund industry as well. He also stated that some hedge fund  managers spread false rumors to drive a stock down: "What's important  when you are in that hedge-fund mode is to not do anything remotely  truthful because the truth is so against your view, that it's important  to create a new truth, to develop a fiction." Cramer described a variety  of tactics that hedge fund managers use to affect a stock's price.  Cramer said that one strategy to keep a stock price down is to spread  false rumors to reporters he described as "the Pisanis of the world".  The comment was a reference to CNBC correspondent Bob Pisani, who  reports from the trading floor of the New York Stock Exchange. "You have  to use these guys," said Cramer. He also discussed giving information  to "the bozo reporter from The Wall Street Journal" to get an article  published. Cramer said this practice, although illegal, is easy to do  "because the SEC doesn't understand it." During the interview Cramer  referred to himself as a "banking class hero.""
Even though I have  traded in the stock market for many years, it wasn't until I recently  starting trading stocks using TD Ameritrade's ThinkorSwim trading  platform, where I can quickly analyze stock trading over various time  periods (day(s), month(s), year(s)) as well as over short intervals  (even as short as a minute), that I began to realize how shorts were  manipulating the market. Since May 1st of this year when a short attack  began against Herbalife (HLF), I have been following all of the activity  surrounding that company including all news stories as well as all  daily trading activity.

Before I began researching the  information for this article, I began to see (HLF) trading activity that  didn't make sense to me. In fact, it really didn't make sense that two  companies under different ownership and management but mainly just  sharing the commonality of being MLM's, Herbalife's and Nu Skin's (NUS)  shares were both attacked at the same time. Here is a link to both  company's charts- HLF chart and NUS Chart , where you can see how their  share price has traded over the last few months. (SUGGESTION: Use 6  month time period as well as candlestick format for the charts)

 Even though I believe there has been manipulation of Herbalife's (HLF)  shares on a daily basis, I want to focus on the manipulation that  occurred immediately after Herbalife reported Record 2nd Quarter 2012  which I discuss in greater detail in my article- "Herbalife Shorts  Shorted More Shares To Stop Upward Share Price Momentum" In order to  stop longs enthusiasm and the momentum created by a great 2nd quarter,  shorts continued to added 585,409 shares of HLF shorted to their short  positions over the period August 1, 2012 to August 15, 2012 to not only  stop Herbalife's share price from rising but to also knock it back down  by $1.85-

Settlement Date Short Interest Closing Share price  
8/15/2012 13,007,577 $53.05  

7/31/2012 12,422,168 $54.89  

 You might think an additional 585,409 shares shorted sounds like a  small number of shares shorted since Herbalife has over 100 million  shares outstanding. However, when you realize that there was only  actually 11 trading days during that time period, and when you also  understand that the shorts used computerized selling and buying of  shares at opportune times to manipulate the share price, you should  understand why they were able to control Herbalife's share price during  that time period, to stop the upward share price momentum, and then to  drive the share price slightly down.

How it works

This  process can be used by hedge funds to either pump up a stock or to  trash a stock but since I am using Herbalife as an example, we will  discuss that situation. First information is widely distributed to make  investors wonder about the company and to put fear into those longs that  hold the stock. Next, high volume shorting takes place to drive the  company's share price down.

As  the short attack continues, more people parade out news to continue to  put questions in the back of investors' minds. On a daily basis, shorts  use computerized trading to control the direction of the share price. At  opportune times, the shorts overwhelm the buyers (bid price) of the  stock by selling short large number of shares to drive the share price  down and to eliminate the buyers for the stock at that given time. For  people who are not familiar with the bid/ask process of trading stocks,  here is a link to explain that process.

Shorts need to  control the stock's share price over a long time (often several months  to well over a year), and can't afford to just accumulate an unlimited  number of short positions in the stock, so they have to be buying shares  at the same time they are selling shares too. When the shorts drive the  share price down, eliminating buyers as discussed above, some of those  investors trying to sell their shares at that same time will follow the  share price activity downward lowering their ask price.

Now  the shorts can buy back some of the shares they have shorted at lower  prices including some shares where longs have put stop-loss sale orders  to protect against downside losses. The shorts will only buy shares part  of the way back up as the share price rises, and then wait to see if  new buyers come into the market. If the share price continues to rise up  to much again during the day, the shorts will repeat the same selling  and buying process to control the share price.

As mentioned  above, the shorts need to control the share price over an extended  period of time. They need to wear down the longs with rumor mongering as  well as by creating fear as the longs continue to see the share price  go down from the computerized trading. They hope the longs will give up  and sell their shares at the lowest possible share price.

 Another observation, shorts try to wear down the longs by making sure  that the share price closes down as many days in a row as they can put  together. At the close of each day, I witnessed volume dramatically  increasing as the shorts tried to insure Herbalife's share price closed  down. Shorts are hoping the longs frustration with the share price  continuing downward will end up in capitulation where as many longs as  possible just give up and sell their shares.

I don't know how  low the shorts will drive the share price of Herbalife during this  current short attack, but I do believe Herbalife is a strong good  growing company. As with all false short attacks, the share price will  bounce back. After the share price bottom is reached, I expect the  shorts to continue their rumor mongering so they can continue buying to  cover their shorts as the share price rises back up.

Since  Herbalife is already in its 5th month of being attacked by shorts, and  if history repeats itself, anyone buying shares of Herbalife (HLF) at  this time should be in for some nice gains over the next 6 to 12 months  as Herbalife's share price rises back to and above where it was when  this short attack began. The shorts greatest fear is that people will  figure out their lies to soon, and the share price will rise up to  quickly. I think there is a good chance for that to happen as a lot of  people will be learning more about this scheme.

Also I have  to believe this manipulation has to involve collusion between all the  major players in the Herbalife short attack since it wouldn't work like  it has if they didn't work together. If one or more of the major short  players decided they didn't want to participate further in driving the  share price down, and decided to buy to cover, this would create a major  problem for those other major short players. The remaining major short  players would not only have to drive the price down based on selling  shares to new longs but would also have to sell shares to those other  major short players buying to cover their shorts. The remaining short  players would not be able to manipulate the stock share price as easy as  they did working together.

If you are wondering why would  they short more shares even when a company like Herbalife is obviously a  healthy growing company. Here is the reason. Since the shorts already  have the investment community wondering about problems, introduced by  the shorts themselves, concerning the company; since shorts have already  shorted $745 Million+ (12,422,168 X $60 per share (my guess at average  share price shorts sold their shares at)) shares of Herbalife; and by  just adding almost $32 Million (585,409 X $54 average-?) more shares  shorted, the shorts were able to take the steam out of a lot of the  longs' enthusiasm over the 2nd quarter financial news, and now the  shorts believe they will have a better opportunity to buy to cover their  shorts at a lower price as well as they will have more time to do so.  At least that's what the shorts hope for.

Also from the  shorts view, they have offset that additional $32 Million of shorting by  reducing the basis of the 12,422,168 shares they already had on their  books by an almost $23 Million (12,422,168 X $1.84 share reduction) of  increased unrealized gain. On top of trying to obtain direct profits  from controlling the share price, and since shorts know more about the  direction of the share price, shorts are able to make more profits from  selling and buying options. I would have to believe these option profits  could run into the millions of dollars too.

As you can see  from the large dollar amounts involved in Herbalife's short attack,  these must be big players and they must have a lot of influence over the  marketplace which brings me to my next subject.

I am really  concerned about the investment reporting we are getting from the media  especially from CNBC's reporters Jim Cramer and Herb Greenberg. Jim  Cramer, who apparently couldn't recommend Herbalife's stock during the  last short attack in 2008-2009 which included the same short arguments  currently being used, "Herbalife Short Attack: History Repeats Itself.";  changed to repeatedly recommending to buy the stock as the stock  climbed up to the $70+ range, and then abandoned longs once again by  changing to not recommending Herbalife's stock as he tells everyone per  this 8/8/12 video "Lightning Round" (see video at 2:50).

It  appears Cramer just abandoned those Herbalife longs again including  those that purchased their shares based on his recommendation to join  his hedge fund buddies that are short Herbalife. Cramer claimed that he  couldn't recommend Herbalife based upon a decision made over 4 years ago  by Herbalife to not fight a legal battle with Barry Minkow, a convicted  felon which his fellow CNBC reporter Greenberg brought to his attention  and discusses in his article, "Why Did Herbalife Pay Felon Barry Minkow  $300,000?: Greenberg". I have fully explained, in the following linked  article, why Herbalife made the decisions they made surrounding this  issue and have emailed this information to both Cramer and Greenberg  with no change or response by either of them- ""Response To Greenberg:  Reasons Why Herbalife Paid Felon Barry Minkow $300,000"

As  far as to Greenberg's reporting, I don't know what his connections are  to the big hedge funds shorting Herbalife, but I think he seems  desperate to come up with "what if this happens" issues to the point  that even Per this CNBC 7/31/12 interview of Michael Johnson, Herbalife  CEO by Cramer and Greenberg (at 10:18 of video), Johnson seemed puzzled  when Greenberg frantically blurted out his last question as if he was  trying to search for one last dagger to put in Michael Johnson's back-

 Greenberg's question: "You are very big in Mexico- Wal-Mart had  problems in Mexico- How do we know you are not paying bribes in Mexico?"  
Johnson's response to Greenberg: <laughing> "You are coming  from a very interesting place. We got to get you wired for positive."
Other CNBC commentators: <laughing in background> "How was that a follow up for the Avon question?"
How to tell a correctly shorted stock versus a short attack bluff

 Since David Einhorn's innocuous questions on Herbalife's conference  call seems to be the event that started the short attack on Herbalife,  and since Einhorn loves poker, I will use poker terms to explain how you  can determine whether a stock is shorted for good reasons or just a  bluff.

If you believe you have a winning hand in poker, you  want everyone else to put in as much cash as they possible can. You  don't want to tip them off in any fashion that you have the winning  hand. You want the pot to as big as possible when you show your hand. If  you don't have a good hand and are bluffing, you need to be sneaky  putting in bets when you really know you don't have a good hand hoping  that the other players fold their winning hands. You don't even want  others to put more cash in the pot since you want them to drop out of  the game.

First you need to understand that the object for  shorts is selling as high as they can and then buying as low as they can  if they have to cover their short position. For those of you who are  not familiar with selling stock short, here is a link to explain short  selling. Also when longs are selling their positions, they will always  try to sell their shares at the highest price they can get.

 If you knew a company's share price was really overpriced for any  reason, you would not do anything to tip anyone else off until you had  shorted all the shares you could. Then, given the right opportunity to  show your hand, you would explain your position as to why the shares  were over priced in a logical fashion. Yes, there would be other shorts  jump in to help drive the share price down but it wouldn't necessarily  be about driving the share price down based mainly upon high volume  trading. You would be ok with longs coming into the market to drive the  share price up (more cash in the pot) since it would give you more of an  opportunity to short at a higher price before your real prediction came  true.

If you were a short bluffing (basically manipulating a  shares' price) about a company's overvalued share price, you might not  want to draw attention to yourself since you could get accused of stock  manipulation so you would hope (or plan for) others to get involved and  to present seemingly good reasons to short the stock. You would want to  put as much fear into longs as possible and would use high volume short  trading as well as buying to drive the share price down as low as you  can and as long as you can. You really want the longs to fold and to get  out of the game. If you are consistently seeing sellers overwhelming  buyers driving a share price down as a stock seems to be going up, I can  assure you it's probably shorts selling since longs are totally  motivated to sell their shares at the highest possible selling price.

 Here is what one stock investment reporter from one of America's  premier financial magazines, who had wrote some articles about  Herbalife's situation which I disagreed with, emailed me (I will not  give his name out as I don't want to cause him problems.)-

 "I'm no lawyer but doesn't it reek of stock manipulation? I would think  so. A lot of hedge-fund types I come across are skittish about appearing  in the media whatsoever, much less being portrayed (correctly) as  tanking a stock.

It could be as simple as a (well-advised) desire to not invite more regulatory scrutiny."

 I believe that stock market manipulation by big players is a major  problem. I know this article focuses on one stock, but just like  cockroaches, if you can find one, I am sure there are a lot more out  there. The only way we are going to make changes in this society is to  make as many people, especially our elected officials, aware of this  problem as we can. I am sure this problem steals money from the vast  majority of our investments and retirement programs. If you agree with  me, and you want to help me try to do something about this problem, by  getting the word out, please email this article, post to facebook,  twitter, LinkedIn, etc. links to this article, of my blog, to as many  people as you can.

As for me, I am long HLF shares and I  still believe that Herbalife shares are a great buy as per my article,  "Herbalife Shorts' Problems Could Be Great Buying Opportunity For  Longs".

 
COOP News (ehemals: Wamu /WMIH) Schwarzwälder
Schwarzwäld.:

sos137 - zu 22268

2
13.07.13 20:48
Hi Sos,

danke für den ergänzenden Hinweis, damit haben Sie natürlich recht !
Das hätte ich vollständigkeitshalber hinzu schreiben können ...

Gruß und schönes WE.,
SW.

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